A "clean car"... what is the 'control' reference used?

I just wanted to start off by thanking everyone for all the information I have learned on this discussion board. I have been browsing through these forums a lot the past few months and have learned MANY new things. These forums have become an invaluable reference for me. Now, onto the topic:

Every owner/operator on here at one time or other has spouted off the mantra of "a clean car, every car" that comes out of their wash. It's the only way to run a business and the only way to remain competitive in today's industry. Well, I'm posting this topic today to find out what is the "clean car" starting reference point? I ask this because I took a tour of car washes in my area these past few week to talk to other operators, look at what equipment other people are using and to see what the end result of other tunnel washes turn out to be.

Now, we all know what a "clean-car" is... ideally, it is a car that has no bird-poop, no bugs, no tar, no sap, no water stains, no brake dust in the wheels and a nice reflection/shine in the paint. Now, a clean car is easily achievable when the vehicle has been maintained with regular washes and care. But what about those vehicles with bird-poop and bugs left on the car for a week and allowed to bake in the hot sun with a 1/4" of brake-dust built up on the wheels? Does the definition above of a "clean car" also apply in this circumstance? I know the answer is that it ideally SHOULD apply but in my tour of local washes (and even in my own experience), this was FAR from the case.

I saw cars go in with bird droppings on the roof of the car and come out of the drying room with residue still left on. I saw cars go through an application of HF on the wheels and then a high pressure rinse and the rims still came out black in the nooks and crannies. I saw cars go through with bugs and debris on the lower side rocker panels and come out with it still left on there.

Talking to the various owners/managers of these washes, they all have one thing in common: They all FIRMLY believed they put out a good product... a clean car. And I would say that roughly 65% of the overall cars I watched go through these various tunnels did indeed come out clean. Roughly, another 25% I would say were passable (if someone was really going to nit-pick they could complain about a few problem areas on their car), and the remaining approximate 10% were, in my opinion, unacceptable and the customer would have a genuine/valid complaint.

So, I came to a conclusion. There must be some reference that everyone uses to establish if their wash is producing a clean car. This reference would be similar to a 'control' used in scientific experiments to establish a starting point. In the case of car washes the control vehicle would be, FOR EXAMPLE, moderately dirty and if after entering and leaving the tunnel, it was nice and clean, then in fact your wash does put out a clean car. But if a vehicle entered that was INCREDIBLY/HEAVILY dirty and it exited ALMOST clean (perhaps rims still a little dirty with brake dust and wheel wells still having some dirt residue), does this still pass the definition of a clean car?

Ultimately, the problem (I believe) I am running into is this: what I believe/expect to be a clean car is NOT what other people believe/expect. I do not know if my expectations are set too high and maybe I should lower them to match what appears to be the general consensus of what is a clean-car?

I know this entire posting is subject to various personal opinions and definitions. From what is a 'moderately dirty' car to what is a 'clean-car', there are just too many personal variables to make this an easily answered question. It's just frustrating for me because I want to be able to attain the holy grail of a clean/dry/shiny car EVERY time and when I started this road trip, I hoped to learn and absorb useful knowledge to improve my wash. But I returned with a feeling of "there really isn't much I can do to improve" and I should "just live with our results". Which unfortunately, isn't the feeling I wanted to return with.

- J.

J
You brought up some interesting information. Years ago I visited a car wash in Pittsburgh (Mr. Magic).In fact I ended up buying my equipment from him. His cars were so clean that he challenged to you to find it with a white glove - now this was a challenge and he was right. I have never found another car wash that could clean cars so well. He sold chemicals as well.
He had a friction wash (AVW) with triple mitters, side blasters, mirror blasters, wheel blasters, top blaster, two tall and two rocker panel brushes (with cloth of course). He had at least 15 - 20 hp blowers (half of the blowers were heated. His chemicals were very strong and he used almost straight HF for the wheels. He washed in excess of 215k cars annually. I tried to duplicate his wash (with his assistance) but never quite got there - because of location and my limited space for additional equipment, etc. The other washes around me clean cars so - so. I too do not have perfect cars, but they are clean. We towel dry, so we have a chance to get the areas the equipment misses. It is hard to get a car really clean with touchless - not that its not happening, but the best attempt to get a car clean is with friction, high pressure and the proper chemicals.
There are very large washes around me that clean a car good. I always thought that the best clean car to be had is with fricton, good equipment, concentrating on using quality chemicals with the right dilutions with constant monitoring. I recently added a side supervisor to insure the cars are done properly. He directs the cars, directs the attendants and is the last person to inspect the car before it leaves - and I mean everywhere !
Don't try to compare yourself to others or accept that this is the best you can do - and don't let your help talk you out of doing the best they can do. If that's the attitude of the help then get "other help".

Well, that's my two cents.

Joe

I would have to say that there is no control reference used at all. It does not matter what the operator or owner thinks the only thing that matters is what the customer thinks. So that "control" of clean will very on every single car. From what I understand only one out of every 20 people that have a problem actually complain. So if your wash gets one complaint a day does that mean that you really have 20 unhappy customers everyday? I would say the answer to that is, maybe. People don't always go to the same car wash because there car gets perfectly clean. People in the US are working more and more every year. Have bigger families with more activities going on. So the fact that you have a very convenient location may be more important than the wash further away they does a better job. I would say an indication that this is true is the popularity of in bay automatics. Most operators may not be putting out a perfectly clean car but it is safe to say that most are putting out an acceptable result, thus the reason why they are still in business.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and so is a "clean car".
Perception is part of it. Customers expect to get a better wash out of a long tunnel ride verses an much short IBA. They expect to get a better wash when they have paid and waited for a full service. They expect a little less when getting a low priced express exterior and are willing to do some of the prep for that price break.

I tell customers that I have a very gentle wash that is not going to remove or clean some things: mildew, heavy bugs, heavy brake dust, pine sap, road tar, bird droppings. We have a very liberal rewash policy but if the customers don't prep before the rewash the results are usually the same. My guide on attendants will often spot problems and inform customers of a free rewash before we send them through.

When I was a full service, customers loved to verbally destroy my whole service based on one minor flaw. I would take care of the flaw but verbally rebuild the service by confirming with them that they were happy with all the other items in the service. Windows bad?...I'm sorry..how was the vacuum the dusting, the wheels and whitewalls...etc.

I've owned an IBA and SS. It never ceases to amaze me how happy customers can be with the results of those facilities. Perception!

One of my main competitors told me a story last week. At church, he overheard a lady, that didn't know him, saying that my car washes put out a clean car. That's when you know you doing ok, maybe not perfect, but ok.

Maybe the control is a hand washed car. If you're coming close to that you're doing good.

That said, the carwash most capable of this benchmark is self-serve. Sorry tunnels and in-bays!

Good point...I think, if a terry towel, with light pressure, will take something off, then our equipment and solutions should also. When you are handwashing, you have the luxury of stopping on those tough areas and putting more pressure there, than what you could safely, expect from equipment. And I would put the level of clean and shine that I put out, up against any handwash. Especially the level of shine.

I could very easily double my cost per car on chemicals and still only clean 5% better. I get more complaints about soap left on the car than I do stains. There's a peak to the graph of effectiveness for time, friction, chemicals and temperature. After that peak, you have diminishing returns. With temperature, it's 120 deg. I believe.

I could adjust my brushes to clean more aggressively for that 5 to 10% but I would start damaging 10% of the vehicles that go through.

As Confucius says, there must be balance grasshopper.

Hand wash, yikes! Most of the time when I see people hand washing they are using laundry soap, washing in direct sunlight, and almost guaranteed to miss a spot. Not to mention a sub par drying job. I would take an average express wash vs an average hand wash any day. (I know you probably mean a hand wash in a ss bay, but thoes other things are what I think of when I think of hand wash)

Actually, Waxman is dead-on with his handwash remark. When consumer tests are done, the baseline benchmark is what the consumers are most familiar with and can do themselves. It is a valid consumer standard of measurement. That common standard harks back to when carwashing still was done manually, and is a standard used by most OEMs dealing with vehicle cleanliness.

Accepting that the evolution towards automation has a long history of compromises, and recognizing that the carwash industry has made tremendous strides in overcoming many cleaning challenges, it is still a very wise choice to hold the original benchmark of a very thorough handwash and hand-drying process as the gold standard. Otherwise, we'd only be kidding ourselves.

As technology changes, the industry must comply and adjust to those changes while avoiding any convenient excuses or justifications... and continue the uncompromising challenge for excellence. While excuses abound, anything less than that pursuit would be cheating all those in this industry who went before you, striving to achieve a better result.

Continue the passionate pursuit of excellence, and feel personally good about it!

-Steve

Homer mentioned people using laundry soap. So true. I've known people to use dishwashing soap, laundry soap, hair shampoo, citrus cleaners and even vinegar. All of these soaps/cleaners are not recommended for a cars finish. It is interesting to note that very few consumers know this. It would be wise for operators to educate customers on this information.

Joe

That's why it's necessary to educate people about car care every chance we get. Like Smokun said, I'm passionate about what I do and I always try to inform people about great ways to care for their cars.

I think any fully automated system has its flaws. Hand work is the ultimate finisher in any carwash format. This gets expensive with labor, but I understand some charge for aftercare services ike towel drying. That's good!

I utilize a free towel dry station outside my wash exit. Both my IBA and SS customers use it and love it. I have very few wash quality complaints and the ones I do get are usually people with unrealistic expectations, IMO. I also vend a bunch of dry towels out of my vendor!

First of all, the idea that tar and tree sap can be cleaned by a commercial car wash is simply wrong. These are items that must be detailed off ar at least manually using mineral spirits to dissolve them.

As for brake dust, it completely depends on how regularly the car is washed, what product is applied to loosen it, what equipment is used to remove it how easy or difficult it is to actually penetrate the rims,and how bad the wheels are to begin with. Rim cleaning is the biggest dilemma for an operator. Just as with touchless cleaning, you want to use products that can go on every type of wheel and can deliver 90% clean. Trying to get the other 10% almost always involves using dome very dangerous chemicals that can only be applied to certain types of wheels. Apply the wrong product to the wrong wheels and you can easily ruin a set of very expensive rims. For wheels that are really bad, hand detailing again would be necessary.

As for vehicles that present special but not insurmountable problems - mud, snow, ice, heavy bugs, and bird crap - prepping is essential if the vehicle is going to come out clean the first time through. This is the critical question for you as an operator. How important is to you that your car wash put out a clean car the first time through. Sure I have a free re-wash policy if we miss something the first time, but how many people are really going to take the time to come back around and complain vs.just leaving thinking they got screwed with a sub-standard car wash.

The issue of vehicle prepping is I believe determined in large part by the price you are charging. With the $3.00 -6.00 wash format, prepping becomes even more costly and less likely to be performed and re-washes more prevelent. If you are charging $7.00 -$10.00 per wash, prepping becomes essential if you are going to address extra-pordinary conditions the first time through and differentiate yourself from the $3-6 washes.

Aside from extra-ordinary conditions vehicles present, I believe that many vehicles present hard to reach areas that equipment alone is not going to reach/cover and will leave dirty. Even if those vehicles are simply re-washed without addressing the problem manually, those areas will still not come clean. If these areas are not clean after a re-wash, are people going to bother to complain a second time? I don't think so. We don't prep much and what we do prep, the front, windshield and rear of every vehicle with hogs hair brushes always come out clean regardless of vehicle shape, size or wash frequency. But I am a perfectionist by nature. I am convinced that's why we are different from most of our competitors and have only seen a 6% drop in wash volume year to date when others around me are experiencing drops of 20-30% or more. When dollars get tight, people pay even more attention to the quality of the dollars they do spend.

I sure the rest of ya see this also. Mobile detailers using your site for themselves and to prep their customer cars. I have 3 or 4 detailers per site, that use my $4 express to wash and vacuum before they apply wax. That's fine with me as long as they don't wax on my site.

To me that's the epitomy of lazy, but at least they're not letting run-off from "commercial" car washing into storm drains. I'm sure it also reflects well on your business to have your customers see that van in your tunnel.

Jim...

You may be overlooking an opportunity with the mobile detailers. Step back... and take another look at the bigger picture.

-Steve

There is no control reference. Every location I have been in consists of varying opinions of what is acceptable for clean. I have seen vehicles I thought were "clean" only to have operators pull it to the side and the employees touch it up more. I have seen the opposite where a car was unacceptable in my opinion only to have it sent out in that condition. Everyone has experienced the customer who thinks they should have gotten more for their wash or the opposite with an estatic customer over a basic wash. None of these are right or wrong it is just a matter of opinion. The real question is how acceptable is your opinion of clean to your customers opeion of clean?

lol sorry typo opeion = opinion

First of all there is a difference between a car wash and a detail. Even in some cases, the baked on brake dust cannot be removed from wheels after hours of hand scrubbing and brushing.

Also, if you are a full service car wash vs a conveyorized exterior there is a difference.

As a very successful operator friend of mine often states, for $5.00 we are not selling perfection, we are selling value.

As for insect residue and bird droppings I have found that with the right application of chemical at the front end of the wash you can remove the bird-droppings and insects, assuming you have sufficient brushes in the wash tunnel itself.

Bottomline, a clean car is what your customer's believe it is and show you by returning to your wash every week, twice a week or whatever. If you are not doing much volume and all else is equal then you could assume your definition of clean is not what your customer's expect.

Regards
Bud Abraham